Brexit for Dummies
 

Brexit for Dummies  

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ionicus
(@ionicus)
Noble Member

Lovely to hear from you again, Andrea.

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Posted : May 11, 2019 9:01 am
Gothicman
(@gothicman)
Trusted Member
Posted by: @gothicman

My opinion as to what should happen now is for May’s defective deal to be voted through, just to be able to officially leave the EU on 29 March in accordance with Article 50.

With the Trade Deal left to negotiate (which cannot be done before we leave) and as nothing is agreed in the negotiations until everything is agreed, we should then get rid of May (and Hammond and Rudd), and replace her with Boris (who is a ‘leaver’, has staunch character and courage, is a great orator, and is extremely intelligent), and then let him, choose his Cabinet,  negotiate the trade deal, with some tweaking to the Withdrawal Agreement in spite of the EU claiming it is closed to further negotiation, including a reduction the 39 billion Divorce Bill, as we don’t have any influence on any future decisions the EU make after 29 March, and should not therefore pay the full amount. The strength of our position as a major trading Nation against the EU has never been exploited or tested by May and her cronies.

I think with Boris the new Prime Minister, the Conservatives would still win the next General Election!

Others may disagree.....

God's in his Heaven, Nikke's survived being flattened, Guajiros still thinks the British are stupid, Boris is to be Prime Minister, and all's well with the world! My predictions from March are almost spot on as usual? Next? If Parliament opposes the No Deal exit 31st October, the Establishment (incl. the BBC) will continue to force it all on to a General Election and Boris will be backed by Nigel's Brexit Party, all the undemocratic shite MPs will be kicked out of parliament, and Boris's Conservative Party will rule supreme with a huge majority; and Brexit will be a fact.

IYP may disagree.....

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Posted : July 23, 2019 12:34 pm
guajiros
(@guajiros)
Reputable Member

Who gives a shit.

 

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Posted : July 23, 2019 1:28 pm
ifyouplease
(@ifyouplease)
Famed Member
Posted by: @gothicman
Posted by: @gothicman

My opinion as to what should happen now is for May’s defective deal to be voted through, just to be able to officially leave the EU on 29 March in accordance with Article 50.

With the Trade Deal left to negotiate (which cannot be done before we leave) and as nothing is agreed in the negotiations until everything is agreed, we should then get rid of May (and Hammond and Rudd), and replace her with Boris (who is a ‘leaver’, has staunch character and courage, is a great orator, and is extremely intelligent), and then let him, choose his Cabinet,  negotiate the trade deal, with some tweaking to the Withdrawal Agreement in spite of the EU claiming it is closed to further negotiation, including a reduction the 39 billion Divorce Bill, as we don’t have any influence on any future decisions the EU make after 29 March, and should not therefore pay the full amount. The strength of our position as a major trading Nation against the EU has never been exploited or tested by May and her cronies.

I think with Boris the new Prime Minister, the Conservatives would still win the next General Election!

Others may disagree.....

God's in his Heaven, Nikke's survived being flattened, Guajiros still thinks the British are stupid, Boris is to be Prime Minister, and all's well with the world! My predictions from March are almost spot on as usual? Next? If Parliament opposes the No Deal exit 31st October, the Establishment (incl. the BBC) will continue to force it all on to a General Election and Boris will be backed by Nigel's Brexit Party, all the undemocratic shite MPs will be kicked out of parliament, and Boris's Conservative Party will rule supreme with a huge majority; and Brexit will be a fact.

IYP may disagree.....

all I am saying is that obviously your politicians who work for TPTB all of them, controlled opposition included are playing a game with the EU and there won't be a solution regarding many issues ON PURPOSE, they will be using excuses to prolong Brexit until the solution is what they want. yes they are clowns but clowns on a mission, never underestimate a clown on a mission. 

 

I plead not ordinary

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Posted : July 23, 2019 1:33 pm
Gothicman
(@gothicman)
Trusted Member

@guajiros

The British give a shit....but then....you're not British are you...which has been my point (and statistical back-up) all throughout the discussion. Why comment at all about 'the British' if you're not going to contribute something sensible rather than obnoxious?

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Posted : July 23, 2019 1:59 pm
ifyouplease
(@ifyouplease)
Famed Member

Trevor by the way, please join the new Fiction Challenge.

and hopefully you can persuade others to try too!

I plead not ordinary

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Posted : July 23, 2019 2:10 pm
guajiros
(@guajiros)
Reputable Member

Of course the British give a shit. That's why the Union is in such a mess and possibly in danger. 

I am not British, I am English, pure Southern English Saxon our traceable family goes back nearly 800 years, but like you for whatever our reasons I do not live in my country.

Maybe the British in general are not stupid (it is just an expression of course) but a lot of the English definitely are.

If you read my comment carefully I said I am apolitical. The only thing that bothers me about Brexit is that is has - and still is - costing me thousands which I can ill afford to lose. So please get off my back, I have no desire to keep reading snide remarks about me. I'm here to write and read other's decent work, not discuss the idiocy of World politics.  

This post was modified 5 months ago by guajiros
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Posted : July 23, 2019 2:21 pm
guajiros
(@guajiros)
Reputable Member

@ifyouplease

Precisely 

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Posted : July 23, 2019 2:26 pm
guajiros
(@guajiros)
Reputable Member

I don't know why you drag me into this thread just because I made a comment on an entirely different subject.  And what's all this about statistical back up? What are you some sort of UKA spy? 

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Posted : July 23, 2019 2:56 pm
Gothicman
(@gothicman)
Trusted Member

@guajiros

Stop being so obtusely aggressive, guajiros, when you can't actually prove you've got the bottle to back it up? The remark may have been meant to draw you in to the discussion, but a little humour, especially in the face of drastic changes, which may well affect all of us, wouldn't go amiss? When I researched the London Referendum vote, on who had actually voted, I found it was recent arrivals that had voted to remain, more than the indigenous population (who more often travel in to work from outside, i.e. are not resident). It's just a plain statistical fact; there is no quality judgement of the voters. (I have friends from all walks of life, from all parts of the world, and I appreciate them all equally). There are two possible explanations for this: those working in the financial hub of London want to remain in the global situation/markets they're in, and also, there is the different levels of appreciation/connection with Britain's long past history, as opposed to bringing own culture with them, and therefore wishing Britain to become a multi-cultural society, which consequently makes them less inclined to accept British-culture integration and national independency. Explaining phenomena using statistics is just about establishing certain facts, and without any quality-judgements being applied, is not racial nor nationalistic?

Can we proceed, even if not agreeing eye to eye in political discussions and perhaps on most things, at least on a more convivial footing?

This post was modified 5 months ago 2 times by Gothicman
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Posted : July 23, 2019 4:09 pm
guajiros
(@guajiros)
Reputable Member

Well I never thought of myself as aggressive obtuse or otherwise. I try to avoid aggression. 

I don't really want to discuss Brexit anymore. I agonised over it back in 2016 even though, like you I suppose, I wasn't allowed to vote being a Brit out of the UK for over 3 years. I knew before the vote how a yes vote would affect me and I was right. I jumped up and down, cursed David Cameron etc etc. Then I realised there was nothing I could do or say. I've  just had to come to terms with the fact my fixed income (pensions) would drop by 10% and my savings in my UK bank by 20%.

I've learned to live with it, there is nothing more to discuss, it won't change anything for me --- Brexit is a Major inconvenience.

All I can hope for now is the mess will clear up and sterling will climb to a decent level and being a non-EU resident won't affect my rights here very much, but somehow I think I am pissing into the wind on both counts.

The country I knew and loved disappeared long before this latest debacle. 

This post was modified 5 months ago by guajiros
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Posted : July 23, 2019 4:59 pm
ifyouplease
(@ifyouplease)
Famed Member

 

all countries are like this

I plead not ordinary

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Posted : July 23, 2019 5:29 pm
Gothicman
(@gothicman)
Trusted Member

@guajiros

Fair enough, I can understand you being fed up with this long drawn-out process, it is frustrating and carries a lot of uncertainties with it while unresolved. I'm very much involved in British politics at the moment, at a distance, helping an "old (friend)/new (political) acquaintance" out with some research and general admin work, so very much in the thick of it, and enjoying every moment, if I'm honest!

You're probably like me, getting half your pension from UK and half from the country you officially reside in? As the cost of living fluctuates with the state of the currency in both countries, and while each pension is paid in local banks, and as long as I don't need to do any money conversions when in either country, I'm not too affected by the rise and fall of either currency. There are reciprocal agreements too, so that tax is only paid in the one country that pays the pension, i.e. no double-taxation, and healthcare costs and other benefits have been aligned. Etc. The coming restrictions on air travel may be a problem though? Dual-nationality takes about four months here, and many Brits have taken it, but, I'll just hang on, I don't think I'll be thrown out! (Famous last words?)

Once Brexit occurs, there will be lots of bilateral business deals done with individual European countries. For example, Sweden and the UK are developing the new state of the arts British fighter aircraft, the Tempest, together (sharing investment  costs and some technology). Once the divorce bill's out of the way, or in the event of a No Deal (collective) situation, it'll be a lot easier eventually to get good reciprocal customs deals on most things, including services, good  for both the UK and the EU, which will, at the same time, help resolve the Irish border problem?

Are you based in South America, or perhaps Spain?

 

This post was modified 5 months ago by Gothicman
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Posted : July 23, 2019 5:46 pm
guajiros
(@guajiros)
Reputable Member

@gothicman

No I don't live in either of those places although I've spent a lot of time in Spain in recent years. I have Spanish friends. I like it there.

I worked for a very large German company for many years and also a Belgian international group. I'm in the Netherlands area.

This post was modified 5 months ago by guajiros
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Posted : July 23, 2019 7:17 pm
guajiros
(@guajiros)
Reputable Member

@alfie_shoyger

As I said: I wasn't allowed to vote.

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Posted : July 23, 2019 7:24 pm
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